Author Topic: LED germicidal lamps  (Read 5422 times)
Binarix128
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LED germicidal lamps « on: May 29, 2020, 01:46:19 PM » Author: Binarix128
What do you think? Those LED thinks are just to laught!  :lol:

A video from Big clive: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_EVw_AhPJ7E&feature=youtu.be

*Note that there actually real uvc led, but they are made of metal and they are very expensive.

But, the part that is not that funny is the fact that pleople buys those bulbs believing that actually those are germicidal, when those are just blue LED or blacklight.
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xmaslightguy
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Re: LED germicidal lamps « Reply #1 on: May 29, 2020, 02:02:01 PM » Author: xmaslightguy
I'll watch the vid later. (currently watching something else)

I've seen so-called "germicidal" LED lights on eBay when looking for real germicidal lamps.
infact now if searching I include -led because I don't want to even see that fake crrap.

I also see standard BLB and BL lamps (plus others) listed as germicidal.
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Re: LED germicidal lamps « Reply #2 on: May 29, 2020, 02:27:04 PM » Author: sox35
I've seen a few of Big Clive's videos on these so-called 'germicidal' lamps, it's only the fact that the guy is so hilarious to watch that makes it bearable, otherwise it would be too depressing.

Oh, I put -led when searching for anything, otherwise so much crud comes up it's hard to see what's real or not. :curse:
« Last Edit: May 29, 2020, 02:31:21 PM by sox35 » Logged
Binarix128
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Re: LED germicidal lamps « Reply #3 on: May 29, 2020, 02:28:21 PM » Author: Binarix128
I wonder if there are non coated normal glass cfl rounding over here. I think the regular glass used is cheaper than spetial glass that allows short uv.
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Binarix128
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Re: LED germicidal lamps « Reply #4 on: May 29, 2020, 02:31:41 PM » Author: Binarix128
I think those led will do a good jog giving a morgue looking to your white room.  ::)
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Binarix128
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Re: LED germicidal lamps « Reply #5 on: May 29, 2020, 02:50:37 PM » Author: Binarix128
Oh, I put -led when searching for anything, otherwise so much crud comes up it's hard to see what's real or not. :curse:
When I look for  :inc:  or  :mv:  at local internet shops (a site like E-bay, but in Chile; called Mercadolibre) My entire screen and of course sometimes my first result, and only few related results. not mattering what I am searching is LED, junk LED from local and of coure china costumers  >:(, that's annoying, spetially the outher sellers, and they become even more annoying since the site doesn't have an exterior costumers filter, and even more when the site removed the notice below the product that says that it is international.  :curse:

Just check it yourself:

https://listado.mercadolibre.cl/ampolleta-de-mercurio#D[A:ampolleta de mercurio]

https://listado.mercadolibre.cl/ampolleta-incandescente (this one was better than expected)

https://listado.mercadolibre.cl/tubo-fluorescente#D[A:tubo fluorescente,L:undefined]

Actually chinese sellers are quite easy to spot due to their bad Spanish.  ;D
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sox35
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Re: LED germicidal lamps « Reply #6 on: May 29, 2020, 02:54:22 PM » Author: sox35
Actually chinese sellers are quite easy to spot due to their bad Spanish.  ;D
Their English isn't much good either  :lol:
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Binarix128
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Re: LED germicidal lamps « Reply #7 on: May 29, 2020, 03:05:14 PM » Author: Binarix128
Their English isn't much good either  :lol:
Cursed translations easily comes.

https://articulo.mercadolibre.cl/MLC-463458522-lampara-de-mercurio-de-organix-moderno-con-bombilla-cfl-_JM#position=1&type=item&tracking_id=5e9ece9b-5ecf-4df4-a8fc-d43c94fb353b  :lol:
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Re: LED germicidal lamps « Reply #8 on: May 29, 2020, 05:47:53 PM » Author: Medved
Well, not that such germicidal LED wont be feasible.
I came in contact with an UV curing LED: 255nm, 2W input, few 100's mW UV output, cost about $500 just the LED device alone (I was asked to help design the ballast for it).
For some reasonable germicidal setup comparable to G15T8 you would need about 5 of those. Tell me, who would pay $2500, plus some fixture and ballast, for something you may get in the $100 ballpark include the fixture.

Note for the curing process the LED makes very sense, because it could be very accurately controlled, both in dose, as well as space (optics), so it only cures the desired spot exactly as designed for the given process. There the few 100's mW is way enough (it is about curing less than 1mm diameter spot at a time; applications like 3D print,...), the cost is justified as well - it is mainly a cheaper, although less acurate alternative for a laser.
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Re: LED germicidal lamps « Reply #9 on: May 30, 2020, 05:38:34 AM » Author: merc
Buyer Beware: This LED Bulb Sold As Germicidal Doesn’t Emit UV-C. Shame they offered these on Amazon.

Some people have always known how to make money on human fear, hence snake oils of any kind.
It's not an LED/non-LED question. Real germicidal LEDs do exists. But with majority of today produced lamps being LED, it's much easier to make a fake UVC LED bulb than a fake UVC low pressure discharge lamp. Moreover, with the E26/E27 base it's an easy plug-in option for most people. And nobody gets hurt by the radiation. :D
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Binarix128
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Re: LED germicidal lamps « Reply #10 on: May 30, 2020, 08:44:06 PM » Author: Binarix128
...Moreover, with the E26/E27 base it's an easy plug-in option for most people. And nobody gets hurt by the radiation. :D
:lol:
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Re: LED germicidal lamps « Reply #11 on: May 30, 2020, 09:48:06 PM » Author: Lumex120
Buyer Beware: This LED Bulb Sold As Germicidal Doesn’t Emit UV-C. Shame they offered these on Amazon.

Some people have always known how to make money on human fear, hence snake oils of any kind.
It's not an LED/non-LED question. Real germicidal LEDs do exists. But with majority of today produced lamps being LED, it's much easier to make a fake UVC LED bulb than a fake UVC low pressure discharge lamp. Moreover, with the E26/E27 base it's an easy plug-in option for most people. And nobody gets hurt by the radiation. :D
Currently if you go on eBay and search for germicidal lamps almost all of the top results will be regular BLB CFLs listed as germicidal UVC.
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Re: LED germicidal lamps « Reply #12 on: May 31, 2020, 06:09:58 PM » Author: James
It will be quite some time before UVC LEDs really challenge traditional technologies for the simple efficiency reason.  Most traditional lamps are pretty inefficient, typically converting about 1% to 35% of their electrical energy input into light.  By contrast LEDs can achieve around 60%.  However the low pressure mercury discharge is remarkably efficient in converting electrical energy to UVC radiation, also peaking at almost 60%.  Meanwhile the UVC LEDs are quite new, and in best case in the lab can only achieve about 10% conversion efficiency.  Commercial devices are only about 3-5% efficient.  In parallel their total output is much lower, they are very expensive, and their lifetime is usually greatly inferior to discharge lamps.

Unfortunately though, the Germicidal discharge lamps are generally produced on the same machines as general lighting fluorescent lamps, which are dying out fast.  The manufacturers of the raw materials are disappearing quickly, which is driving up prices and introducing new quality issues that did not used to exist.  When the fluorescent types do inevitably stop, it is uncertain if it will be economically viable to keep a factory open that was built to produce hundreds of millions of tubes per year, and restructure for a few tens or maybe a hundred thousand germicidal tubes.  As such there is a real risk that in the next few years we may be forced down the UVC LED route even if it is not yet the best solution.
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sox35
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Re: LED germicidal lamps « Reply #13 on: May 31, 2020, 06:38:03 PM » Author: sox35
...there is a real risk that in the next few years we may be forced down the UVC LED route even if it is not yet the best solution.
I don't want to be forced down the LED route, I want a choice of what I use. Not just for UVC, but all lighting. Why is it that the whole world seems fixated on LED to the exclusion of all else..? Maybe they are ok for some purposes, but surely not ALL  ???

Yet the unstoppable march continues. I never thought I would be glad to be getting older, but there are some things that are happening in the world I just don't want to be around to see come to pass, and a fully LED-lit world is one of them  :sadbulb:
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Binarix128
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Re: LED germicidal lamps « Reply #14 on: May 31, 2020, 08:17:13 PM » Author: Binarix128
For some reason they want to lit all by LED, for "save the planet".

I think if that continues its rithm we will reach a point that even in smaller markets of spetial aplications other types of lamps will be missing, or even every light that comes from electricity MUST BE LED, until new tecnologies appear.

It is like digital vs vinil or cassete tapes now in day, there are pleople that preferes quality or retro instead of cheapnes, but with LED most is middle quality and quality LEDs are so expensive that even incandescent will be cheaper.

I think that world of "LED everywhere" is just a period of 10 years or less, like with cfl, or it may be over 100 years like with incandescents. But some day a new think will appear, better or worse, but it will appear.

EDIT:

That doesn't mean that this night LED must dissapear from stores completely, LED is actually a better choise than others in some applications, but that the LED is the only choise for everything is not good.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2020, 11:23:59 PM by Binarix128 » Logged
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