If it doesn't turn on with a new lamp and photocell Xcel would install a new fixture without any further troubleshooting and the old entire fixture would go to the recycler.

That's what the power company does here (and is a waste of resources). I was referring to non-utility owned parking lot lights for which they are not responsible. Re-lamping at regular intervals would have been cheaper in the long run.

Years ago, the power company had linesmen refurbish street lights on slow, rainy days when there was little else to do. Nowadays, time is money...

Over here they would happily replace ignitors. Also, i seen some quite tough ignitors out there - ES50 ticking every night over 17 years, the lantern never had a lamp screwed in....

Not to mention electrical contractors push for led too, I had reviewed a proposal by a contractor several months back which had all kinds of numbers fudged to make their proposal look better. For example they swore up and down that each parking lot pole had two 1000w mh shoeboxes when in actuality they are only 400w each. Not to mention they were going to replace both "1000w" shoeboxes with only one 215w LED. Get outta here!!! There's no physical way one 215w LED is going to perform the same as 2 1000w MH, even if the fixture is only 40% efficient and you take 15% off the top to account for a broken in lamp. They also fudged the on time and kWh charges to make it look like a no brainier. The bad part is the facilities manager didn't catch on to any of this, and he's not an idiot actually a really smart guy. Just not lighting savvy. I redesigned it with two 215w LEDs and recalculated the numbers and it would take about 8 years for them to BREAK EVEN with the initial cost of install. Warranty was 10 years. It's also complicated further by the fact that not all the 52 poles in the parking lot light up every night. About half are only used two to three times a week and only for a few hours each time at that. Makes the maths harder and easier for them to fudge if your not looking (which they did).

I havent seen one LED installing company that doesn't fudge the numbers. It goes all the way up to the manufacturers

Yep, whatever it takes to move that product. Market is almost saturated with HID, we need something else to be "better" to make people want to retrofit everything in addition to new construction. Gotta fatten up the bonus and the stocks, woohoo.

And someone is most likely thinking about the post-LED era, when every luminaire will be changed to something new, just like the LED today. And not just in lighting, all industries have CEO's that want that platinum Rolex and that new Mercedes...

Yea they're not worried about who comes after them just gettin the gettin while there is still something to get while they still have to get it. People who come in after they've left fat and rich and be having to deal with the aftermath. Part of the problem beyond lighting, enough folks in high places just care about whatever it takes to keep their rear in the chair and rich to cause problems. If it makes the whole thing fall apart after they leave, so what? They got their money. Hey we just make the best with what we have, I'd say we're doin alright.

Look, I hate LEDs (except in general use), is that they start strobing and flashing and fail by the driver ballast, which is kind of a annoyance.

Look, I hate LEDs (except in general use), is that they start strobing and flashing and fail by the driver ballast, which is kind of a annoyance.

If you hate LED's except for when they are in general use... you've kind of contradicted yourself there...

I ment, I use them in general use.

Any new stores that I've seen open here in the past couple years have been LED lit inside...and in all honesty most of them from a looks/brightness perspective are just fine. Infact I doubt most people would even know the lights aren't fluorescent. LEDs have certainly come a long way since the early generation ones.

If you hate LED's except for when they are in general use... you've kind of contradicted yourself there...

There's going to be another entry in "Things that annoy you" in a minute, why the [censored] do people say "kind of" all the time, as if it were some form of punctuation..? 

There's going to be another entry in "Things that annoy you" in a minute, why the [censored] do people say "kind of" all the time, as if it were some form of punctuation..? 

Yes. you have either contradicted yourself or you haven't. 

I didn't say anything wrong. I like LEDs, that I use them in general use. Nothing wrong there.

Yes. you have either contradicted yourself or you haven't. 

Ehh if it annoys you... read over it, I'm likely not going to change my typing or speaking habits much anytime soon...