Which starter is suitable for 2x8W T5 lamps in series operation? « on: October 26, 2012, 02:31:42 PM » Author: dor123
After all of my chemical bottles for my chemical mosquito repellent will over, I will buy a bug zapper with 2x8W T5 lamps in series. This is the smallest bug zapper available in Israel with a preheat magnetic ballast and easy lamp replacement (The single 8W T5 ones sold here, are the cylindrical ones, that have a capacitive/resistive instant start ballast, are hard/impossible to relamp, and have a very short lamp life), and with a common lamp wattage rating (8W is the most common wattage rating alongside the short T5s [Including bug-zapper UVA T5s], the 4W and 6W, are rarer]). After I will buy my 2x8W T5 bug-zapper, I will plan, to replace its OEM glow starters to preheat electronic starters (Pulsestarters), to prolong the life of the lamps and the bug-zapper itself. I want to know which wattage range of starter, is required for 2x8W T5 lamps in series operation, for optimal performance and long lamp life (A starter wattage range = Min wattage-Max wattage. For example 18-65W for 18W and 36W T8 and 20W and 40W T12). Also, is it possible to buy an Arlen Pulstarters directly from Arlen website?
« Last Edit: October 26, 2012, 02:37:35 PM by dor123 »		Logged

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	Re: Which starter is suitable for 2x8W T5 lamps in series operation? « Reply #1 on: October 26, 2012, 03:23:47 PM » Author: Medved
You need the "series" starter, so S2,... These are rated for "4..20W" or so (the maximum lamp wattage rating is 25W and below). But the bug-zapper is the kind of application, where the starting method does not matter as much, as the lamp is started once per many burning hours. What matter way more is the lamp drive style. Here the capacitive ballasts in the cheepeese zappers is indeed one of the worst for the lamp life. The best for the lamp life in such application would be the HF electronic (and I would keep it the simplest instant start, simpl;y because it is the simplest circuit, so have the chance to have the least failures during the lamp life), but there the ballast itself would be the main reliability pain (it would quite frequently die with the lamps, so it would need a repair; therefore use good quality fuse to avoid PCB damage)... So the standard preheat choke is indeed the optimum compromise between the lamp life (reasonable) and ballast reliability/life (nearly infinite). And as the starting method is not important for the long hours/start usage pattern, I would keep the glowbottles, they are the simplest and so I would expect them to be the most reliable.
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	Re: Which starter is suitable for 2x8W T5 lamps in series operation? « Reply #2 on: October 26, 2012, 03:36:25 PM » Author: dor123
Modern electronic starters, are usually dies after much more lamp replacements than most modern glow starters (Osram ST glow starters, usually dies with the lamps). Also, I plan to connect the bug-zapper to my mechanical timer switch, so it will be turned on at dusk and off at 4:00 or 5:00, and not plans to operate it 24/7, in order to save energy (I think that it isn't needed during the day). Also: Electronic starters have an EOL shut down protection and automatic restarting, which can prolong the life of my bug zapper. Also: If there is a power interruption, it willn't short the lamp life with preheat electronic starters, as with glow starters.
« Last Edit: October 26, 2012, 04:20:51 PM by dor123 »		Logged

I"m don't speak English well, and rely on online translating to write in this site.
Please forgive me if my choice of my words looks like offensive, while that isn't my intention.

I only working with the international date format (dd.mm.yyyy).

I lives in Israel, which is a 220-240V, 50hz country.

	Re: Which starter is suitable for 2x8W T5 lamps in series operation? « Reply #4 on: October 26, 2012, 06:29:50 PM » Author: dor123
Ash: Rectification can also overheat the ballast, because this cause a higher current than normal to follow it (Even if this is less than a stuck starter, where the ballast is effectively shorted). I don't think that the bug-zapper should operate 24/7 in my room. This is a waste of energy. I will connect it to my timer switch, so that it will turned on at dusk, and off again at 4:00 or 5:00. Also, I will turn it off, when I will leave my hostel to go to my father or to my mother. So the reliability of the starting is important to me.
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I"m don't speak English well, and rely on online translating to write in this site.
Please forgive me if my choice of my words looks like offensive, while that isn't my intention.

I only working with the international date format (dd.mm.yyyy).

I lives in Israel, which is a 220-240V, 50hz country.

	Re: Which starter is suitable for 2x8W T5 lamps in series operation? « Reply #7 on: October 26, 2012, 06:52:36 PM » Author: dor123
Ash: The mosqitos nets aren't enough, to prevent me from being stung.
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I"m don't speak English well, and rely on online translating to write in this site.
Please forgive me if my choice of my words looks like offensive, while that isn't my intention.

I only working with the international date format (dd.mm.yyyy).

I lives in Israel, which is a 220-240V, 50hz country.

	Re: Which starter is suitable for 2x8W T5 lamps in series operation? « Reply #8 on: October 27, 2012, 01:46:44 AM » Author: Medved
Even the 8..10hours/day is a lot to make the starting method not important on the magnetic ballast, the operation hours would still be responsible for majority of the wear. It would start to play a role with average ~2hours/start, but for average 8hours it does not make any difference. If you really want long lamp life, go for the HF electronic, for continuous operation (8hpurs/start count as continuous operation) their lamp wear is way less than the low frequency choke. You may use one 11..15W CFL ballast to run both lamps in series, only the resonant capacitor would have to be replaced by two, what make the same capacitance when in series, each of them connected to one lamp. With electronic starters I do not have as good experience: They frequently die without any reason (well, it is electronic like each other, in this case a bit less stressed during life)... The low wattage ballasts have usually so high resistance, than they are way more robust (but less efficient than the higher power models), so you really do not have to worry. @Ash: The nets are not 100% efficient, quite few bugs usually succeed to seep over, what is usually too much to tolerate at night...
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	Re: Which starter is suitable for 2x8W T5 lamps in series operation? « Reply #9 on: October 27, 2012, 02:51:25 AM » Author: dor123
The difference in lamp life between a glow starter and an electronic starter, should be significant. Also, we have many generic glow starters, that have the characteristic of cause the lamps to blink happy during starting. Blink happy = A lot of stress. Also, electronic starters don't as unreliable as HF electronic ballasts, as they consists of fewer components, so they don't heats at all, and can survive many lamp replacements. This problem of reliablity in electronics, is correct only for HF electronic ballast, which consists many electronic components and are heating. HPS and pulse start MH lamps, operates with external electronic ignitors for several tens of years now, and these ignitors are very reliable and can left buzzing or clicking without lamp or with a worn out lamp for years. The Eltam ES-50 semi-parallel HPS ignitor, is electronic I think, but it can last for many years and can click continuously for years.
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I"m don't speak English well, and rely on online translating to write in this site.
Please forgive me if my choice of my words looks like offensive, while that isn't my intention.

I only working with the international date format (dd.mm.yyyy).

I lives in Israel, which is a 220-240V, 50hz country.

	Re: Which starter is suitable for 2x8W T5 lamps in series operation? « Reply #10 on: October 28, 2012, 03:35:18 AM » Author: Medved
The starter related stress you describe affect only lamp starts, so it would make sense for lamps, what are switched ON and OFF five or more times per day for less than a hour. With the mosquito killer I expect there won't be as many of the switching cycles (not much more than one per day), so that wear, although quite high compare to the electronic starter, is still negligible compare to the wear encountered during steady running (where it have nothing to do with the starter, but it mainly depend on the drive style - mains vs high frequency drive, current level,...) to really influence the lamp lamp life. So in the killer you really do not gain anything with the electronic starter, but you could loose the reliability... So I won't make the setup more complex than it should be...
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	Re: Which starter is suitable for 2x8W T5 lamps in series operation? « Reply #12 on: October 28, 2012, 12:13:16 PM » Author: Medved
Quote from: Ash on October 28, 2012, 11:25:22 AM On my experience electronic starters are very reliable, more than glow starters. I only seen 1 "stuck" electronic starter out of maybe 100's. Glow starters are stuck way more often than that I've seen stuck starters only when they were operated past their lifetime, when not replaced with the failed lamp. Quote from: Ash on October 28, 2012, 11:25:22 AM As for driving the lamp at different current, in continuous operation will the lamp last longer if underdriven a bit ? how much - 0.9 ? 0.8 ? The cathodes, indeed, do have their optimum operating current, where the temperature is high enough for good emission so low sputter, but still not too hot to not evaporate it's components so fast, so the lifetime is the longest. But why do you think the cathodes would be designed to have the optimum operating current different than the rated one? Don't forget the optimum current is a matter of thermal balance, what could be tuned even by how the cathode coil is stretched during the final cathode assembly - so even with one common part (prewound filament wire) could be individually adopted to suit a few lamp types with different current ratings, so even then with each lamp type the operating current would match the optimum.
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