dor123
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I bought an Indonesian Philips golf ball 60W E14 frosted incandescent lamp for a spotlight that I plans to install above my bed, right to my NISKO PL-S 9W. To my surprise, this lamp is rated vertical base-down rather than vertical base-up like you can see in the attachment. Why is this? Can @James or others can explain? @Medved or @RRK can also help me? |
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« Last Edit: July 11, 2024, 09:22:47 AM by dor123 »
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I"m don't speak English well, and rely on online translating to write in this site.
Please forgive me if my choice of my words looks like offensive, while that isn't my intention.
I only working with the international date format (dd.mm.yyyy).
I lives in Israel, which is a 220-240V, 50hz country.
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Medved
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| Probably the socket can not stand the heat from the bulb. Or can not maintain the socket temperature within limits standardized for the E14.
60W is a lot for such small format, moreover these small sockets are expected to be rather enclosed, so with very limited airflow.
The bulb itself being small makes this even worse...
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dor123
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The spotlight itself is black (Even inside), and don't have vent holes: https://www.lighting-gallery.net/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-246625 |
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« Last Edit: July 11, 2024, 02:35:21 PM by dor123 »
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I"m don't speak English well, and rely on online translating to write in this site.
Please forgive me if my choice of my words looks like offensive, while that isn't my intention.
I only working with the international date format (dd.mm.yyyy).
I lives in Israel, which is a 220-240V, 50hz country.
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Caroline
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| It's newly manufactured (can tell by the ENERG*) so they might have added that because of all the plastic sockets in the market. I've seen that in 70W and 83W halogens from Philips.
However if you have a ceramic socket you can use it in any position you want.
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Medved
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| The lamp socket is most likely the limitting factor here, but I wouldn't "underestimate" the design of the lamp itself: The cement holding the metal thread to the glass may lose adhesion...
And having the socket ceramic is not enough, there are other parts that may get overheated. Really 60W is a lot for such small lamp format and the E14 was never ever meant to be operated at higher temperatures, even when they were still made from a ceramic.
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Caroline
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Cement can indeed crack. Some wiring insulation can get crispy with heat as well, with time it can crack and leave the copper exposed  Certain holders will still fail regardless of being ceramic, I've had a few low quality holders have their terminals cracked by heat, it looks like they used lead or some low grade alloy to make them and they simply came off their place or cracked in half. The design itself is pretty bad, the screw isn't connected to any of the wires, instead they only come with a thin ring where the bulb screws in and use a separate piece of aluminium to make contact with the base. For enclosed fittings I exclusively use silicone insulated wiring that won't degrade after being exposed to heat, and a decent type of older style holders. |
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dor123
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| The lamp socket is plastic and is black colored like the rest of the spotlight.
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I"m don't speak English well, and rely on online translating to write in this site.
Please forgive me if my choice of my words looks like offensive, while that isn't my intention.
I only working with the international date format (dd.mm.yyyy).
I lives in Israel, which is a 220-240V, 50hz country.
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Medved
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| The technical standards governing the lamp construction and performance put (beside others) restrictions on temperatures and heat loading of various lamp parts, mainly those making the interface towards the other parts of the system, e.g. the socket.
These restrictions then serve as a base for the design of the other parts, like the sockets or so (material selection,...).
The limitts are chosen so, it allows the final assemblies to be made safe, reliable and at reasonable cost on one side (like at the time they were created allowing the use of cheap bakelite for the socket), yet still do not impose that much of a restrictions on other side (e.g. assuming the intended use will be for low power lamps so maximum power or operating position restriction won't be an issue).
And with the size and power, this lamp meets these limits only if operated base down.
It is possible some socket designs (ceramic sockets using high temp wiring,...) may allow this size and power to work safely and reliably, but that will still violate the standard, so can not be rated that way anyway, so the real socket material (and tempersture robustness) becomes irrelevant, once it meets the standard.
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« Last Edit: July 13, 2024, 12:25:57 AM by Medved »
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dor123
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I'm awaking the thread, because I want to show you the inside of my spotlight when it is assembled and disassembled. @Medved said that E14 lamp sockets are expected to be rather enclosed. The lampshade is held to the lamp socket by a plastic O ring. Without the lampshade, all of the lamp socket can be seen, while with the lampshade, only the front part of the socket can be seen (See attachments). It this what Medved related to? |
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I"m don't speak English well, and rely on online translating to write in this site.
Please forgive me if my choice of my words looks like offensive, while that isn't my intention.
I only working with the international date format (dd.mm.yyyy).
I lives in Israel, which is a 220-240V, 50hz country.
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Medved
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| It is mainly the fact there is not much room for the cooling air to flow around.
If this is operated base up, it forms an upside down cup, holding the hot air trapped in it without any circulation at all. And in that environment it is not that difficult for any part, like the socket, to exceed any reasonable temperature and start to degrade rather quickly.
The lower power lamps do not generate that much heat, so even when the positioning is not that good for cooling, the temperatures are rather safe. But with such high power as 60W or so, it is able to stay at reasonable temperatures only in the most favorable conditions, so open fixture and mainly base down, so the rather sensitive socket is not exposed to the hot air stream from that and the hot air stream goes away from anything more sensitive than the bare glass bulb...
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